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Whit George

CNLP 085: Whit George on How to Work with Family in Ministry, Taking Over Leadership, and Learning How to Lead in A Brand New Role

Church on the Move in Tulsa, Oklahoma, is known for innovation. It’s also about to undergo a significant leadership transition.

Today I talk with the driving force behind much of the creative innovation at the church in the last decade, Whit George, who is the Executive Pastor and one-day Senior Pastor of COTM, as he prepares to succeed his father, Willie George.

Welcome to Episode 85 of the Podcast.

 

whit-george

 

Guest Links: Whit George

Seeds Conference

WhitGeorge.Consulting

Church on the Move

Whit on Twitter 

Links Mentioned in this Episode

Josh Gagnon; Episode 61

Andy Stanley; Episode 1

10 Reasons Even Committed Church Attenders Are Attending Church Less Often

Chris Vacher

Tom and Todd Mullins

Haydn Shaw; Episode 69

Bill Hybels

Lasting Impact Team Edition is available today!

IMG_7604

I’m excited to announce that the Lasting Impact Team edition releases today! It’s a compilation of eight videos designed to allow the teams in your church follow along with as a supplement to the book. I highlight key points from the material and discuss additional hot topics that relate to your ministry.

To be the first to get your copy, visit LastingImpactBook.com! Plus, if you order right away, you will gain access to a private Facebook group where I’ll answer questions from time to time, and where you’ll have the support of many other leaders trying lead the same conversations in their church. But hurry. Access to the private Facebook closes at 11:59 May 31st 2016.

Get your copy of Lasting Impact today! 

My latest book is available now. It’s designed especially of church leaders and their teams.

Lasting Impact frames 7 pivotal conversations every church team needs to have, covering subject like declining church attendance, team health, creating a culture volunteers love and how to engineer change in your church.

Order on Amazon, or visit LastingImpactBook.com! The video team edition, featuring 8 videos where I teach through the key concepts in the book, is available now as well!

3 Things You Can Do Right Away

Whit worked his way from being the church landscaper to being in senior leadership, but his advancement was inherited from his dad. When you follow in the footsteps of someone else, how do you make your own path, and what does that transition look like? Whit tells us about the struggles he encountered and how he worked through them.

  1. You will get frustrated. “It didn’t matter how good my dad did it,” Whit said. “I was always going to be frustrated.” Frustration is part of human nature. Look at Adam and Eve, and look at Peter and Judas. They were two different situations, neither were happy, and there was a great deal of vexation toward indignities. The reality is that it doesn’t matter if you were working at the perfect church or your leader is perfect, because of sin, you’re going to get frustrated.
  2. Embrace differences. Stop being frustrated, embrace change and enjoy it. Whit said God spoke to him. “If everything was done the way I wanted it done, there would be no need for me.” So often we lose patience with how something is said or done, and we don’t stop to analyze the heart behind it. In your prayer, start telling God thank you for what’s meant to be in your life. Turn your frustration into thankfulness. When you’re thankful, it’s hard to be angry.
  3. Be patient. Focus on the things you can control, leverage them and let God do the rest. It easy to hold on to control in the midst of transition because you want to see progress, but when you’re praying into your faith, don’t ask for authority, take responsibility. As leaders, we lose patience with how long it takes for things to happen, so be mindful of God’s timing.

Quotes from this Episode

A New Episode Every Week…Just Subscribe

The podcast releases every Tuesday morning.

Subscribe for free and never miss out on wisdom from great leaders such as  Jon Acuff, Mark Batterson, Pete Wilson, David Kinnaman, Caleb Kaltenbach, Kara Powell, Casey Graham, Perry Noble and Andy Stanley.

Subscribe via

iTunes

Stitcher

TuneIn Radio

Appreciate This? Rate the Podcast.

Hopefully this episode has helped you lead like never before. That’s my goal. If you appreciated it, could you share the love?

The best way to do that is to rate the podcast in iTunes and leave us a brief review! You can do the same on Stitcher and on TuneIn Radio as well.

Your rating and review helps gets the podcast in front of new leaders and listeners. Your feedback also lets me know how I can better serve you.

Thank you for being so awesome.

Next Episode: Josh Whitehead

In 2003, Joshua Whitehead left business to start serving at Faith Promise Church. Since 2005 he’s served as Executive Pastor and seen the church grow to 5 locations and 6,800 people. Josh and I talk about why so many leaders don’t trust each other and how to overcome the gap.

Subscribe for free now, and you won’t miss Episode 86.

asking better questions

7 Keys to Asking Better Questions (What I’ve Learned From My Leadership Podcast)

If you want to become a better leader (and who doesn’t?), the key is simple: learn to ask better questions.

I wish I knew that 20 years ago when I started.

I thought leadership was about giving answers, not asking questions.

I still have to reign myself in from talking too much and listening too little, but I’ve worked hard on the art of asking questions over the last few years.

In mid-2014, I became immersed more deeply than ever before into the art of asking questions as I prepared to launch my leadership podcast (you can subscribe for free here).  It’s been an amazing journey, as 20 months in we just celebrated passing one million downloads. (Thank you to everyone for making the podcast so amazing!)

In addition, last year, I started interviewing for 100 Huntley Street, a national TV show in Canada (here’s an interview I did with Ravi Zacharias).

One of the surprisingly consistent questions I get is how I come up with the questions for my guests.

People seem to notice the approach I take and want to know how I prepare the questions.

The reality is I haven’t known how to answer that question except to say “I don’t know, I just do it.” Not very helpful.

I also get interviewed frequently these days, and I’ve come to the conclusion that there are better lines of questioning, and not-so-great lines of questioning.

So I sat down to try to figure out the principles behind the art of asking better questions.

Here’s what I’ve come up with. I think the principles work whenever you are interacting with someone…whether it’s the foyer on a Sunday, in a meeting, or for a podcast or show.

Asking better questions is foundational to better leadership.

So how do you learn to ask better questions?

I want to keep growing in this field, but here are 7 things I’m discovering.

better questions1. Put yourself in their shoes

You may be getting together to discuss an issue, but behind every issue is a person.

When you speak to the person behind the issue, not just the issue, you always have a better conversation.

How do you do that?

Start here: imagine what it’s like to be them.

This is true if you’re talking to Andy Stanley or whether you’re talking to a college student anxious about what’s next after graduation.

People have emotions, fears, dreams, hopes and experience everything else you do.

A great way to access this stream of thinking is to imagine the questions you would have if you were them.

Imagine launching a church that grows exponentially. What would your hopes, dreams and fears be?

Sure, the person you’re speaking with might respond differently than you would (and be open to that), but this at least gets you into the same emotional ball park.

If you can imagine what it’s like to be them, your questions will not only become better, but they’ll like you. Why? Because you just showed interest and empathy. And we all respond better to an interested, empathetic person.

2. Avoid putting people on the defensive

Most people heading into an interview or conversation are a bit worried—whether that’s a job interview, a podcast or TV interview, or a meeting where you’re asking questions.

They’re afraid they’re going to say something they’ll regret. Or afraid you’re out to make them look bad.

People sense right away whether you’re trying to make them look bad. And they respond to you accordingly.

Any cheap press or momentary victory you get from a controversial quote is in my view, so not worth it.

I never want to make anyone look bad. Even if I disagree with a person.

I just want them to tell their story…and if you put them at ease, they will.

“But what about the truth?” say the suspicious among you.

Well, that doesn’t mean you don’t ask real questions. But in fact, when someone is at ease, they’ll often tell you far more than they would if you put them on the defensive.

If you want to listen to a couple of very authentic interviews on very controversial topics, you can listen to my conversation with Justin Dean on the collapse of Mars Hill Church in Seattle, or Aaron Harris on what it’s been like for him to grow up in the church as gay man.

3. Ask what it felt like

I’m a logical guy. I think a lot. I’m a law school graduate. Most of what I do these days boils down to thinking, solving problems and then figuring out how to communicate what I’ve learned.

As a result, I constantly process principles behind why things are the way they are, and why people do what we do.

But deep down, we’re all emotional creatures. I am. You are.

So is anyone you talk to.

If you really want to connect with the person you’re speaking with (or interviewing), when they tell you about a critical moment in their life (good or bad) ask them what it felt like.

What was it like to learn you had cancer?

What did it feel like to have half your church walk out overnight?

What did it feel like for you as a leader to go from 100 people to 1000 people attending your church overnight?

What were you feeling when you failed out of college and had to go home to tell your parents?

In those moments, you move from head-to-head conversation to heart-to-heart conversation.

And those are my favourite conversations. That’s the kind of stuff around which friendships and bonds form—both between you and your guests, and your guests and any listeners.

4. Look for the counter-intuitive or exceptional

Lots of counter-intuitive things happen in life.

Follow that trail.

For example, when I interviewed Perry Noble about burning out in Episode 2 of my leadership podcast, he mentioned it happened when his church had never been bigger and when things had never been ‘better.’

That really surprised me, and we spent a good part of the interview exploring that.

Exploring the counter-intuitive usually leads to great places because it attacks widely held assumptions. For example, people assume you burn out with things are going poorly, not when things are going well.

In a similar way, people are surprised that successful people struggle.

In my view, that’s what made the interview I did with Passion Ministries founder Louie Giglio so riveting. He talked openly and honestly about how success led him to break down and how he battled back.

Bottom line? If something surprises you, chase it.

5. Drill down

Our world is filled with 2-minute sound bites.

The best conversations in my view never happen in 10 minutes or between commercial breaks. They happen long after people have used all their sound bites and pushed past their ready-made answers.x

I took a risk in doing long-form podcasting when I launched (the average episode is around an hour). The reason I chose that path is because meaningful real life conversations tend to be longer, not shorter.

Taking your time also allows you to drill down on key issues.

Whether it’s my podcast, a meeting, or even a job interview I’m conducting, most of my questions are unplanned. I always write questions out ahead of time, but you can’t really anticipate the good stuff.

When you hear something someone says that piques your interest, drill down on it.

Go further. As in:

What do you mean by that?

Fascinating…tell me more.

What happened next?

What…say that again? What happened?

That kind of questioning opens up the floodgates for new insights and principles.

If you just move onto the next question, you usually lose a goldmine in the process.

6. Be curious

Curiosity is your best friend as a leader.

When you’re interviewing, act more like a 6-year-old than a 36-year-old.

Ask why…a lot.

If you’re genuinely curious, ask:

Why did you think that?

Why do you think that happened?

Why didn’t you quit?

Why did you make that decision?

‘How’ is another amazing curiosity question:

How did you even think that was possible?

Wait, how did that happen?

How did you possibly think that might work?

Even in a meeting setting, you will learn so much more about the person you’re talking with or the issue you’re studying if you stay curious.

The best leaders I know are insatiably curious.

They want to know how and why things work, and they want to know more about the things they don’t know about.

So…be curious.

7. Forget about yourself

Too many leaders are interested in making a point rather than asking a question.

And that’s a critical mistake.

If you’re always trying to show how smart you are, you accomplish the opposite.

When I started my podcast in the fall of 2014, my wife listened to the first few episodes and said (in a very loving way), “You talk too much.”

I felt like saying, “It’s MY podcast!”

But she was right.

Since that time, I try to talk less than 10% of the time in a interview (unless the interview is designed to be a two-way conversations, as a few have been).

I’ve tried to talk a lot less in my daily leadership as well. It’s way too easy for me to dominate meetings and I have to put a constant check on my tongue and brain.

After all, leaders, when you listen first and speak second, people are far more interested in what you have to say.

What Do You Think?

Hopefully asking better questions leaves you and whoever you’re talking with feel amazing after a conversation. That’s my goal whenever I talk to a leader, on air or off air.

If you want unlimited free access to my podcast, you can subscribe for free here on any of these channels:

iTunes

Stitcher

TuneIn Radio

RSS feed

In the meantime, what helps you ask better questions? Scroll down and leave a comment!

Brent Ingersoll

CNLP 084: Leading a Rapidly Growing Turn Around Church at Age 29: An Interview with Brent Ingersoll

Leading a turnaround church is tough.

Leading it after the previous leader experienced moral failure is even harder.

Doing it all at age 29 makes the story remarkable. Brent Ingersoll stepped directly from student ministry into the senior leader’s chair where he’s led the church to rapid growth and expansion in an area in which few churches are growing. Here’s Brent Ingersoll’s story.

Welcome to Episode 84 of the Podcast.

brent-ingersoll

Guest Links: Brent Ingersoll

Kings Valley Church

Brent on Twitter

Brent on Instagram

Brent on Facebook

Links Mentioned in this Episode

Tim Guptill; Episode 63

John Stickl; Episode 29

Andy Stanley; Episode 1

Celebrate Recovery

3 Things You Can Do Right Away

In his late 20s, Brent became the lead pastor of a church that was on the decline after irreconcilable conflicts with the former pastor. From his experience, Brent walks us through the steps he took to develop a team, grow his ministry and hang on to faith in the process.

  1. Let God go to work. Brent was thrown into a situation where the only resource he had was God. When you’re in the midst of a difficult season, recognize that God will pour out His grace, and trust that He wants to do amazing things through you. Don’t try to rush through the turmoil or dust it under the rug. Let God do what He’s supposed to do. Brent says to “let the wrecking ball hit,” and once the dust settles, you’ll have a huge opportunity to make lasting changes. Your church will be listening, and they’re ready.
  1. Understand risks related to growth. Expect attendance to turnover, but don’t take it personally. People are going to leave, yet others will want to see what’s new. People are still finding Jesus, and their families are excited about it. Brent says he sees a lot of new generation Christians in his church, and word-of-mouth has been the biggest influencer. Give people something good to talk about.
  1. Embrace risk and trust God. Brent’s turbulent season allowed him to recapture a vulnerable level of open-handed faithfulness. Remember, you can only say yes to what God wants you to do, and success is as big of a test as suffering. Take hold of God and keep your hands open, not allowing yourself to lose faith in His will. Live within calculated risks where God has to show up. If there’s no place for God to show up and do something, you’re not exercising faith. Give Him the chance to work for you, because the pressure is on God. It’s His church.

Quotes from this Episode

Register now for the ReThink Leadership Conference!

Join some of the biggest influencers in church leadership at the inaugural ReThink Leadership Conference this spring! Hear from Andy Stanley, Jon Acuff, Reggie Joiner and many others as they discuss their experience and practical insight for high-capacity leadership.

Enrollment is limited, so make sure you reserve your spot today!

Available online now! Get your copy of Lasting Impact today! 

My latest book is available now. It’s designed especially of church leaders and their teams.

Lasting Impact frames 7 pivotal conversations every church team needs to have, covering subject like declining church attendance, team health, creating a culture volunteers love and how to engineer change in your church.

Order on Amazon, or visit LastingImpactBook.com! The video team edition, featuring 8 videos where I teach through the key concepts in the book, releases later this month. Stay tune for details.

A New Episode Every Week…Just Subscribe

The podcast releases every Tuesday morning.

Subscribe for free and never miss out on wisdom from great leaders such as  Jon Acuff, Mark Batterson, Pete Wilson, David Kinnaman, Caleb Kaltenbach, Kara Powell, Casey Graham, Perry Noble and Andy Stanley.

Subscribe via

iTunes

Stitcher

TuneIn Radio

Appreciate This? Rate the Podcast.

Hopefully this episode has helped you lead like never before. That’s my goal. If you appreciated it, could you share the love?

The best way to do that is to rate the podcast in iTunes and leave us a brief review! You can do the same on Stitcher and on TuneIn Radio as well.

Your rating and review helps gets the podcast in front of new leaders and listeners. Your feedback also lets me know how I can better serve you.

Thank you for being so awesome.

Next Episode: Whit George

Church on the Move in Tulsa Oklahoma is known for innovation. It’s also about to undersgo a sigifincant leadership transition.

Next week, I talk with the driving force behind much of the creative innovation at the church in the last decade, Whit George, who is the Executive Pastor and one-day Senior Pastor of COTM, as he prepares to succeed his father, Willie George.

Subscribe for free now, and you won’t miss Episode 85.

David-Kinnaman

CNLP 082: David Kinnaman on How Christians are Increasingly Perceived by the Unchurched as Irrelevant and Extreme

Is telling others about Jesus an act of extremism? What about waiting for marriage to have sex?

David Kinnaman, author, speaker and President of Barna Research,  joins us with some shocking findings on what unchurched people really think about Christians and gives us practical ideas on how to bridge the gap between Christianity and the culture we’re trying to reach.

Welcome to Episode 82 of the podcast.

David-Kinnaman

 

Guest Links: David Kinnaman

Episode 24

The Barna Group

Good Faith: Being a Christian When Society Thinks You’re Irrelevant and Extreme

Churchless: Understanding Today’s Unchurched and How to Connect with Them

You Lost Me: Why Young Christians Are Leaving Church…and Rethinking Faith 

unChristian: What a New Generation Really Thinks about Christianity…and Why it Matters

David Kinnaman on Facebook

David Kinnaman on Twitter

Links Mentioned in this Episode

Gabe Lyons

Chris Lema

Connexus Church Online 

Ravi Zacharias; Episode 53

Jeff Henderson; Episode 16

John Ortberg

3 Things You Can Do Right Away

When you look at how culture is shaping the church, and how the church is shaping culture, their influences are moving at different paces. David elaborates on how Christians can shift the conversation.

  1. Recognize the Kingdom things happening in the church. Encourage others by telling them that the church is doing things out of faith, and do more of them. We need to bring the Gospel to the forefront more. Get it out there, and celebrate it! Create a bubble of good faith and acknowledge others’ love of Jesus.
  2. Acknowledge the opportunity for revival. Conditions of culture in North America are ripe for the church to be revived. There’s a hopelessness in our culture in which we think this is going play out. We think people are going to come to the end of themselves, and the church will be a counter-cultural response. We think there is a crisis in how we think about humanity, but the revivals begin within the church. They can happen because the people of God are revived to His purposes in their lives, and we live counter-culturally to the spirit of the age. We think there are tremendous opportunities for revival and renewal, and it should be seen as an exciting time.
  3. Pursue diverse relationships. If we want to live in good faith, ask yourself in you’re in good dialogue with those who have different beliefs. Do you have people of different faiths, backgrounds and world views that you engage with? We need to teach our communities to ask the right questions: what’s wrong, what’s right, what’s missing, and what’s confused? As Christians we believe every person is created in the image of God. When we only understand the brokenness of humanity, we’re only getting a partial description.

Quotes from this Episode

Register now for the ReThink Leadership Conference!

Join some of the biggest influencers in church leadership at the inaugural ReThink Leadership Conference this spring! Hear from Andy Stanley, Jon Acuff, Reggie Joiner and many others as they discuss their experience and practical insight for high-capacity leadership.

Enrollment is limited, so make sure you reserve your spot today!

Available online now! Get your copy of Lasting Impact today! 

My latest book is available now. It’s designed especially of church leaders and their teams.

Lasting Impact frames 7 pivotal conversations every church team needs to have, covering subject like declining church attendance, team health, creating a culture volunteers love and how to engineer change in your church.

Order on Amazon, or visit LastingImpactBook.com!

A New Episode Every Week…Just Subscribe

The podcast releases every Tuesday morning.

Subscribe for free and never miss out on wisdom from great leaders such as  Jon Acuff, Mark Batterson, Pete Wilson, David Kinnaman, Caleb Kaltenbach, Kara Powell, Casey Graham, Perry Noble and Andy Stanley.

Subscribe via

iTunes

Stitcher

TuneIn Radio

Appreciate This? Rate the Podcast.

Hopefully this episode has helped you lead like never before. That’s my goal. If you appreciated it, could you share the love?

The best way to do that is to rate the podcast in iTunes and leave us a brief review! You can do the same on Stitcher and on TuneIn Radio as well.

Your rating and review helps gets the podcast in front of new leaders and listeners. Your feedback also lets me know how I can better serve you.

Thank you for being so awesome.

Next Episode: Ravi Zacharias

Few people alive today have spoken to as many non believers and believers alike as Ravi Zacharias. In this interview, Ravi shares what’s changed in people’s attitudes toward Christianity and what needs to change in Western preaching to effectively share the Gospel with the next generation.

PLUS…next week we have something very special for our listeners. Don’t miss it!

Subscribe for free now, and you won’t miss Episode 83.

perry_noble

CNLP 078: Perry Noble on How He’s Radically Changed His Approach to Leadership

Driven, controlling people have a leadership style that will take their organizations in a certain direction, but almost always cap it at a smaller size than they’d like.

Perry Noble talks about how he stopped being so controlling and learned to lead with love and how you can too.

Welcome to Episode 78 of the podcast.

perry_noble

Guest Links: Perry Noble

PerryNoble.Com

NewSpring Church

The Most Excellent Way to Lead: Discover the Heart of Great Leadership

MostExcellentWayToLead.Com

Perry Noble Leadership Podcast

Episode 2

Perry on Twitter

Perry on Facebook

Perry on Instagram

Links Mentioned in this Episode

Jeff Henderson; Episode 16

How I Recovered From Burnout: 12 Keys to Getting Back

3 Things You Can Do Right Away

Are you leading people to control, or are you leading to influence? Perry Noble discusses how he’s changed his leadership style by having more patience, showing mercy and guiding through love.

  1. Find opportunity in every crisis.  This will take time. Reports show that people, especially millennials, are turning away from the church. If fewer people are going, that means there are more people to reach. Figure out what it’s gonna take to reach them. If they’re not going to church, figure out why, and fix it. The buffer in every crisis is love, and Perry says one of the greatest things to happen to him is letting go of control and leveraging influence.
  2. Don’t exercise control; develop influence. As your church gets bigger, you start to realize you’re losing control. When we control things, we know we have influence. If you’re in control, you lead, but that’s not the best way to lead. Hitler had control, but he’s not the guy any of us want to become. People join an organization, but they “quit people” because control only gets you so far.
  3. Be intentional about the mood you create when you walk in the room. When a leader steps into a room, they either create joy or fear. There’s not middle ground. Leading with love requires us to adapt the mindset that love always assumes the best, and giving people the benefit of the doubt builds equity with people. Driven people have an issue with leading with love. But why does our drive seem to be opposed to love? We’ll tell ourselves that what you did was best for them. When the volume of your voice goes up, your influence goes down. People will let you lead them, but when you drive them, they’ll walk away from you.

Quotes from this Episode

Register now for the ReThink Leadership Conference!

Join some of the biggest influencers in church leadership at the inaugural ReThink Leadership Conference this spring! Hear from Andy Stanley, Jon Acuff, Reggie Joiner and many others as they discuss their experience and practical insight for high-capacity leadership.

Enrollment is limited, so make sure you reserve your spot today!

Available online now! Get your copy of Lasting Impact today! 

My latest book is available now. It’s designed especially of church leaders and their teams.

Lasting Impact frames 7 pivotal conversations every church team needs to have, covering subject like declining church attendance, team health, creating a culture volunteers love and how to engineer change in your church.

Order on Amazon, or visit LastingImpactBook.com!

A New Episode Every Week…Just Subscribe

The podcast releases every Tuesday morning.

Subscribe for free and never miss out on wisdom from great leaders such as  Jon Acuff, Mark Batterson, Pete Wilson, David Kinnaman, Caleb Kaltenbach, Kara Powell, Casey Graham, Perry Noble and Andy Stanley.

Subscribe via

iTunes

Stitcher

TuneIn Radio

Appreciate This? Rate the Podcast.

Hopefully this episode has helped you lead like never before. That’s my goal. If you appreciated it, could you share the love?

The best way to do that is to rate the podcast in iTunes and leave us a brief review! You can do the same on Stitcher and on TuneIn Radio as well.

Your rating and review helps gets the podcast in front of new leaders and listeners. Your feedback also lets me know how I can better serve you.

Thank you for being so awesome.

Next Episode: Justin Dean

In 2014, Mars Hill closed its doors as Pastor Mark Driscoll and all the key staff left and disbanded the church as it then was.

What happened at Mars Hil, though, was not all bad. I interview Justin Dean about the good that happened, what he learned, and what it feels like to be on the inside of a collapsing organization.

Subscribe for free now, and you won’t miss Episode 79.

Ask Carey

CNLP Bonus 006: #AskCarey Part 5

Your questions are the best questions.

We’re back with another bonus episode of Ask Carey. Scroll down to see what questions I tackle this episode: it’s everything from how to grow a church, dealing with ‘committee-led’ churches, and how to engage volunteers.

Welcome to Ask Carey Part 5.

PS. We also have some isolated mystery static in this podcast. Who knows where that came from? We decided to air it anyway. If you can identify the source, you get bonus points. We’re stumped!

Ask Carey

Questions Featured in this Episode

3:12 How do you implement the ideas in a “committee-led” church, where the pastor has little authority, the congregants are aged and resistant to change.

6:05 How do you cast vision so that getting volunteers is easier? (From Conversation #4 in the book.) I want to be able to bring along those high-capacity leaders, and I need help getting them to see the vision.

8:21 How can you strike a balance between having experienced people on a church board and wanting to get younger people in leadership positions?

9:38 What are the best practices for delegating to volunteers and having them own that area? If a church has been hitting a ceiling of 400 for 20 years and never breaking it, what areas should they look at to assess where the issue is?

13:50 How do you lead your church to have these powerful conversations (from Lasting Impact) when there is not an immediate or obvious need to do so?

16:54 How do you determine the next best step in navigating conversations with your board? How do you wake up your fellow leaders to conversations that are coming down the pike in 2 or 3 years?

19:31 Any tips for a conversation about our mainline denomination church and moving forward into the future when we have a stodgy, traditional service? We’re not going to be contemporary, but would like to be more modern to reflect the current expectations.

22:51 I am the pastor of two very small congregation churches in a rural area in western Oklahoma. The population is finite, and the economy is not particularly robust. While we’d like the numbers to grow, we really want to reach younger people. How?

25:13 What is the best way to navigate cultural change from a small church mindset to a large church way of thinking?

28:03 How do you balance wanting to see people engage in their journey with Christ with today’s cultural attitude toward attending church?

31:50 How do you make decisions within your staff?

33:23 Coming on staff as an associate campus pastor, how do you establish clarity for the staff on leadership roles?

Links Mentioned

Carey on Facebook

Carey on Twitter

Carey on Instagram

Carey’s Blog (with link to SpeakPipe)

7 Signs Your Church Will Never Change

5 Disruptive Church Trends That Will Rule 2016

Andy Stanley; Episode 1

Will Mancini; Episode 23

David Kinnaman; Episode 24

Seven Practices of Effective Ministry by Andy Stanley, Lane Jones and Reggie Joiner

Holy Discontent: Fueling the Fire That Ignites Personal Vision by Bill Hybels

James Emery White

The Advantage: Why Organizational Health Trumps Everything Else In Businessby Patrick M. Lencioni

Previous Bonus Episodes

CNLP Bonus Episode #1

CNLP Bonus Episode #2

CNLP Bonus Episode #3

CNLP Bonus Episode #4

CNLP Bonus Episode #5

Quotes from Carey 

Available online now! Get your copy of Lasting Impact today! 

My latest book is available now. It’s designed especially of church leaders and their teams.

Lasting Impact frames 7 pivotal conversations every church team needs to have, covering subject like declining church attendance, team health, creating a culture volunteers love and how to engineer change in your church.

Order on Amazon, or visit LastingImpactBook.com!

A New Episode Every Week…Just Subscribe

The podcast releases every Tuesday morning.

Subscribe for free and never miss out on wisdom from great leaders such as  Jon Acuff, Mark Batterson, Pete Wilson, David Kinnaman, Caleb Kaltenbach, Kara Powell, Casey Graham, Perry Noble, and Andy Stanley.

Subscribe via

iTunes

Stitcher

TuneIn Radio

Appreciate This? Rate the Podcast.

Hopefully this episode has helped you lead like never before. That’s my goal. If you appreciated it, could you share the love?

The best way to do that is to rate the podcast in iTunes and leave us a brief review! You can do the same on Stitcher and on TuneIn Radio as well.

Your rating and review helps gets the podcast in front of new leaders and listeners. Your feedback also lets me know how I can better serve you.

Thank you for being so awesome.

Wayne Cordova

CNLP 066: Time Management and More Practical Tech Hacks With Geek Pastor, Wayne Cordova

Some leaders are tech geeks. Others are not.

The good news is that GeekPastor.com’s Wayne Cordova, my guest on Episode 34is back with his best practical tips to help you get more done in less time.

Wayne will walk you through everything from free apps every team should be using, to how to get rid of most of your email, time hacking and more on this super practical episode.

Plus, he’s got a special bonus for podcast listeners.

Welcome to Episode 66 of the Podcast.

Wayne Cordova

 

Guest Links: Wayne Cordova 

GeekPastor.com

Crosspoint Church

Geek Pastor on Twitter

Wayne Cordova on Twitter

Wayne on Facebook

Links Mentioned in this Episode

Lasting Impact

Michael HyattSlack blog post

Pat Flynn

Jon Acuff

John Maxwell

iPad Pro

Free Apps

Google Apps, suite of apps for email, cloud storage, collaboration tools and more

Gmail, a very basic, user-friendly email system that can be customized to meet your organization’s needs

Google Docs, cloud-based documents to create, edit, and collaborate wherever you are

Google Sheets, cloud-based spreadsheets to create, edit, and collaborate wherever you are

Google Forms, collect and organize information, easily create surveys and sign-ups

Google Drive, cloud-based file storage that allows for easy sharing and access to files of all sizes

Google Chrome, fast, simple, powerful and secure web browser available on any device

Dropbox, cloud-based file storage that allows for easy sharing and access to files of all sizes

Evernote, a workspace that allows you to capture what’s important, move ideas and stay on task

If This Then That / IFTTT, an automation tool to create useful chains of simple conditional statements, called “recipes”

YouTube, video-sharing site, great for finding tutorials on the tools above

PicPlayPost, amazingly simple graphic design software

Word Swag ($3.99), text over pic editor, cool fonts, typography generator, creative quotes

Collaboration Apps

Slack, team communication tool for messaging and file sharing, fully searchable, and on all your devices

Wunderlist, an easy organizational tool to help you get things done faster

Trello, visual way to organize anything with anyone

Skype, video and audio conferencing with messaging and recording

Zoom, cloud video conferencing, simple online meetings, and cross platform group chat

Google Hangouts, group communication with instant messaging, video chat, SMS and VOIP

Basecamp, web-based project management and collaboration tool

Todoist, best online task management app and to-do list

3 Things You Can Do Right Away

An app is never going to teach you leadership. It’s never going to teach you how to love people. So technology doesn’t lead. It simply enhances. When used as a tool, technology plays into the “how” when accomplishing the work of ministry and gives us margin to focus on building relationships. Wayne Cordova walks us through the apps that help him manage his ministry and gives you some great tips to hack your time and productivity.

  1. If it’s free, it’s for me. We get it. Your church probably doesn’t have a budget category for “apps”, and it can be difficult to sell them on new software and technology. Good news: there’s more free apps than ever to help you stay productive and collaborate with your team in real time. Check out Google Apps suite of free software, as well as some great apps for note taking, file storage, graphic design, and automation—all from your phone! What a time to be alive.
  2. Collaborate on-the-go. We’re seeing an increasing trend of remote staff, digital meetings, and online collaboration tools. You no longer need everyone in the room to stay productive and aligned. With the apps mentioned above, you can avoid the inbox all together with group messaging, beam in remote staff with audio/video conferencing, navigate complex projects with sophisticated project management, and share to-do lists to make sure it all gets done.
  3. Get up earlier. We all know the most precious resource we have is time. Feel like there’s not enough hours in the day? Here’s a novel idea: wake up earlier! You can easily gain an extra hour in the morning to knock out some work before the world (and kids) wakes up. Here’s a tip: wake up 15 minutes earlier each day by setting all your alarms for the week in advance. It will take some discipline, but the extra productivity will give you that energy boost you need!

An Exclusive Listener Offer from Wayne

Wayne has put together 3 FREE exclusive webinars for listeners of the podcast. Just go to www.geekpastor.com/carey. You’ll get tips for managing  email, automation and going paperless.

There will also be an invite to sign up for an exclusive, live Q&A Webinar in January just for listeners that you do not want to miss.

With his new webinar series, Geek Year, coming January, Wayne will show you how you can have the geekiest year ever in the most positive way. You’ll get the year started off right, learning how to leverage technology to actually accomplish all of those resolutions and goals you’ve laid out.

Quotes from Wayne

Available online now! Get your copy of Lasting Impact today! 

My latest book is available now. It’s designed especially of church leaders and their teams.

Lasting Impact frames 7 pivotal conversations every church team needs to have, covering subject like declining church attendance, team health, creating a culture volunteers love and how to engineer change in your church.

Order on Amazon, or visit LastingImpactBook.com!

A New Episode Every Week…Just Subscribe

The podcast releases every Tuesday morning.

Subscribe for free and never miss out on wisdom from great leaders such as  Jon Acuff, Mark Batterson, Pete Wilson, David Kinnaman, Caleb Kaltenbach, Kara Powell, Casey Graham, Perry Noble, and Andy Stanley.

Subscribe via

iTunes

Stitcher

TuneIn Radio

Appreciate This? Rate the Podcast.

Hopefully this episode has helped you lead like never before. That’s my goal. If you appreciated it, could you share the love?

The best way to do that is to rate the podcast in iTunes and leave us a brief review! You can do the same on Stitcher and on TuneIn Radio as well.

Your rating and review helps gets the podcast in front of new leaders and listeners. Your feedback also lets me know how I can better serve you.

Thank you for being so awesome.

Next Episode: Chris Brown

 

Money…it’s a problem if you have it and a problem if you don’t. But it’s a unique challenge for pastors.

Every week, Chris Brown speaks to millions of people via radio and podcast, and next week I talk to Chris about the unique challenges and opportunities church leaders face with their personal finance.

Subscribe for free now, and you won’t miss Episode 67.

In the meantime, got a question?

Scroll down and leave a comment!

louie

CNLP 065: Louie Giglio on The Back Story of Passion, His Nervous Breakdown, and How He Came Back

Most leaders will experience a burnout of some kind at some point in their journey. For Louie Giglio, that happened in 2008, when he experienced a nervous breakdown during one of the hardest seasons of his life.

Now, as the pastor of Passion City Church in Atlanta, Georgia, and founder of Passion Conferences—a global movement of college-aged people living for the fame of Jesus Christ, his desire is to see spiritual awakening come to the nation’s college campuses and to see the 19 million college students of the nation and around the world come to know God.

In this episode, Louie talks about how Passion all got started, his nervous breakdown, and how all of us can make a comeback through the resurrecting power of Jesus.

Welcome to Episode 65 of the Podcast.

Louie Giglio

Guest Links

Louie Giglio

Passion Conference

The Comeback

Passion City Church

Links Mentioned in this Episode

Perry Noble; Episode 2

Craig Jutila; Episode 5

sixstepsrecords

Baylor University

Reggie Joiner

Orange Conference

Rethink Leadership

Andy Stanley

Jon Acuff

Brad Lomenick

3 Things You Can Do Right Away

So many pastors and church leaders struggle with burnout, breakdown and exhaustion. If that’s you, here’s what you can do:

  1. Don’t ignore your symptoms. Your body is telling you something. So is your state of mind. When you ignore those, you do so to your peril.
  2. Tell somebody.  Embarrassment and shame often cause leaders to keep silent when they break down physically or emotionally. Tell your best friend. Tell your spouse. Tell your doctor. Tell somebody. They will be far more empathetic than you think.  
  3. Get help. In addition to seeking professional helping and letting the people close to you know, we’ve put together this list of resources that can help leaders who are burning out.

Quotes from Louie

Available online now! Get your copy of Lasting Impact today! 

My latest book is available now. It’s designed especially of church leaders and their teams.

Lasting Impact frames 7 pivotal conversations every church team needs to have, covering subject like declining church attendance, team health, creating a culture volunteers love and how to engineer change in your church.

Order on Amazon, or visit LastingImpactBook.com!

A New Episode Every Week…Just Subscribe

The podcast releases every Tuesday morning.

Subscribe for free and never miss out on wisdom from great leaders such as  Jon Acuff, Mark Batterson, Pete Wilson, David Kinnaman, Caleb Kaltenbach, Kara Powell, Casey Graham, Perry Noble, and Andy Stanley.

Subscribe via

iTunes

Stitcher

TuneIn Radio

Appreciate This? Rate the Podcast.

Hopefully this episode has helped you lead like never before. That’s my goal. If you appreciated it, could you share the love?

The best way to do that is to rate the podcast in iTunes and leave us a brief review! You can do the same on Stitcher and on TuneIn Radio as well.

Your rating and review helps gets the podcast in front of new leaders and listeners. Your feedback also lets me know how I can better serve you.

Thank you for being so awesome.

Next Episode: Wayne Cordova

Wayne Cordova, my guest on Episode 34is back with his best practical tips to help you get more done in less time.

Wayne will walk you through everything from free apps every team should be using, to how to get rid of most of your email, time hacking and more on this super practical episode.

Plus, he’s got a special bonus for podcast listeners.

Subscribe for free now, and you won’t miss Episode 66.

In the meantime, got a question?

Scroll down and leave a comment!

pastor behaves like a CEO

Why You Should Be Thankful If Your Pastor Behaves Like a CEO

Of all the things I hear church leaders slip into conversation, one of the most persistent is the opinion that a pastor should never adopt the attitudes or habits of a CEO.

Instead, the pastor should be a shepherd and tend the flock.

I recently wrote a post about how having the pastor do most or all of the pastoral care in a congregation permanently stunts the growth of most churches to 200 people or less.

I would also strongly argue that church leaders should rethink their bias against the pastor as CEO.

Why?

Two reasons.

First, both the model of shepherd and CEO are based in unidimensional and unhelpful stereotypes.

Second, because the mission and future of the church are fuelled by the growth and potential of our leaders.

pastor behaves like a CEO

Let’s Move Beyond Stereotypes

Let’s move beyond the stereotypes for a moment.

Shepherds are seen as caring, pastoral, gentle and kind.

CEOs are seen as arrogant, brash, selfish, difficult and demanding.

Neither characterization is helpful or, frankly, accurate.

Sure…you can think of CEOs or executive types who fit all the bad stereotypes.

And chances are you’ve made up what a shepherd looks like because, frankly, you’ve never met one. I haven’t.

This Was First Century Shepherding?

From what I know of first century shepherds (and I admit, I don’t have a degree in shepherding), it wasn’t all green meadows and sunshine. Shepherding took quite a bit of resolve and strength.

Shepherds had to keep sheep from drinking out of brackish or tainted water and keep them from poisoning themselves.

Shepherds had to fight off wolves, lions and thieves. Clubbing to lions to death and pulling a lamb out of the jaws of a bear are not for the fainthearted.

Apparently, first century Palestinian shepherds even would break the leg of a wandering sheep to correct its errant behaviour.

Try that at your next congregational meeting.

In an association we often miss, David himself claimed that shepherding prepared him to fight Goliath and, arguably, even become King. He saw it more as leadership development than anything, and leadership in one field ultimately opened leadership in others.

The job was demanding enough that, as Jesus himself said, it might require your life.

Run this description by any effective CEO and they might tell you “That sounds like my job.”

Maybe a first century shepherd was more like an effective CEO than we think.

This is What it Means To Be a CEO?

So are CEOs inherently brash, impatient, selfish, egomaniacs? Well, not effective ones.

Jim Collins’ exhaustive study of truly great companies (companies that outperformed their competitors substantially and significantly) discovered that the great companies had what he called Level 5 CEOs.

Collins and his team were shocked to discover a rare and endearing quality among the CEOs of the truly greatest companies: they had deep resolve to do whatever it took to advance the mission AND a deep, personal…are you ready—humility. 

To quote Collins:

[Level 5 CEOs] are somewhat self-effacing individuals who deflect adulation, yet who have an almost stoic resolve to do absolutely whatever it takes to make the company great, channeling their ego needs away from themselves and into the larger goal of building a great company.

It’s not that Level 5 leaders have no ego or self-interest. Indeed, they are incredibly ambitious—but their ambition is first and foremost for the institution and its greatness, not for themselves.

The most effective CEOs are the most humble CEOs.

I ask you, isn’t that exactly what a Christian leader should be?

Sounds an awful lot like the Apostle Paul to me. Or like Moses. Even like Jesus (if you’re willing to strip away your stereotypes and read what scripture says about Jesus).

Consequently, isn’t that exactly what a great pastor could be?

Saying the model of pastor-as-CEO is bad for the church is like saying leadership really doesn’t matter. It’s also saying business should get all the best leaders.

The mission of the church is too important to be stunted by a poorly thought-through stereotype of a CEO.

If All We Do Is Care For People Until They Die, the Church Will Die

The next decade of the church is critical.

While it’s Christ’s church and God is sovereign, we leaders have a role to play. As even committed church attenders attend less often, the church requires the best leadership, not the most passive or the most friendly.

What often passes as ‘pastoral’ is not pastoral in the first-century sense of shepherding; it’s passive.

If all we do is recruit pastors who love to care for people until they die, the church will die.

I realize this is somewhat hyperbolic, but perhaps it’s less of an overstatement than you think. We’re closing churches in record numbers, largely because pastors want to ‘pastor’ but not lead.

I believe we should care for people until they die, but the pastor doesn’t need to be the sole person to do that.

98% of pastoral care is having someone who cares. It doesn’t have to be the pastor.

Toward A New Generation of Leaders

So what should the next generation of pastors do?

Lead.

Lead humbly. Lead with compassion. Lead with care.

But understand that sometimes leading with compassion means doing what’s best for people…not simply doing what people want. If first century shepherds did that, the sheep would be dead.

Quite simply, the job of a leader is to take people where they wouldn’t otherwise go.

You may be called to take people to the Promised Land, but people always want to go back to Egypt.

It takes tremendous strength, exceptional courage, trust, humility and a willingness to die to self to do accomplish the mission to which God has called the church.

This kind of leadership shift will mean the demise of the people-pleasing, co-dependent leader who longs to be liked. But maybe that’s okay.

The church needs thousands of new leaders who are willing to be incredibly unpopular but will resolve to do what needs to be done.

Somedays I wonder how many Christian CEOs of small and large companies might have been in ministry if our model, expectations and attitude was different.

Next Time Your Pastor Behaves Like a CEO

So what would make this situation better?

Think twice before you say the church needs more shepherds. Or if you do talk about the need for shepherds, talk about the kind of shepherd David was. We sure need more of those.

And think three times before you slam the idea of church leaders being CEOs.

Read a book like Jim Collin’s Good to Great.

Think more deeply about whether the church needs more entrepreneurs. (For reasons outlined here, I believe that’s exactly what we need.)

Realize that truly great CEOs often model exactly what scripture talks about in terms of great leadership, and that maybe our entire mission would advance if we valued those gifts more deeply.

And finally, next time someone says your pastor is behaving like a (Level 5) CEO, be thankful.

More people might be in heaven because of it.

If you want to drill down further, I wrote much more about why the vast majority of churches don’t grow in my latest bookLasting Impact: 7 Powerful Conversations That Can Help Your Church Grow.

What Do You Think?

I realize this is an emotional subject, so play nice in the comments.

But what do you think?

Is the quick dismissal of potentially effective leadership in the church hurting us? How?

Scroll down and leave a comment.

careyjeff

CNLP 056: 7 Powerful Conversations That Will Help Your Church Grow—An Interview with Jeff Henderson and Carey Nieuwhof

You’ve probably noticed …

Churches aren’t growing. Young adults are walking away. Volunteers are hard to recruit. Leaders are burning out. And the culture is changing faster than ever before.

There’s no doubt the church is in a moment in history for which few church leaders are prepared.

But maybe the future belongs to the churches that are willing to have the most honest conversations at a critical time.

In this special episode, I sit down with Jeff Henderson and turn the tables. Jeff interviews me on the seven things it takes for your church to have a lasting impact. Listen as we talk through these vital questions from my new book, Lasting Impact: 7 Powerful Conversations That Will Help Your Church Grownow available at LastingImpactBook.com.

Welcome to Episode 56 of the podcast!

careyjeff

Guest Links

Gwinnett Church

Gwinnett Church on Facebook

Gwinnett Church on Twitter

Preaching Rocket

Jeff Henderson on Twitter

Links Mentioned in this Episode

Perry Noble; Episode 2

Sticky Faith: Everyday Ideas to Build Lasting Faith in Your Kids by Kara E. Powell

LastingImpactBook.com

Lasting Impact | Amazon.com

Lasting Impact | iBooks Store

Lasting Impact | Orange Store

Quotes from Carey

My new book, Lasting Impact, is now available!

Take advantage of the FREE audiobook when you order Lasting Impact this week

If you order my book, Lasting Impact: 7 Powerful Conversations That Will Help Your Church Grow, October 6-12, you’ll receive a free audio version of the book with additional commentary.

Lasting Impact frames seven pivotal conversations every church team needs to have, covering subjects like declining church attendance, team health, creating a culture volunteers love and how to engineer change in your church.

You can place your order at LastingImpactBook.com! But hurry. The bonus goes away at midnight on Monday, October 12.

 A New Episode Every Week…Just Subscribe

The podcast releases every Tuesday morning.

Subscribe for free and never miss out on wisdom from great leaders such as  Jon Acuff, Mark Batterson, Pete Wilson, David Kinnaman, Caleb Kaltenbach, Kara Powell, Casey Graham, Perry Noble, and Andy Stanley.

Subscribe via

iTunes

Stitcher

TuneIn Radio

Appreciate This? Rate the Podcast.

Hopefully this episode has helped you lead like never before. That’s my goal. If you appreciated it, could you share the love?

The best way to do that is to rate the podcast in iTunes and leave us a brief review! You can do the same on Stitcher and on TuneIn Radio as well.

Your rating and review helps gets the podcast in front of new leaders and listeners. Your feedback also lets me know how I can better serve you.

Thank you for being so awesome.

Next Episode: Aaron Harris

Aaron Harris knew from the time he was young that he was attracted to other men. After running from the church as a teen he ran back into it in his twenties, deeply convinced that Jesus is the only way. Aaron shares what he wishes was different in the way the church talks about same-sex issues and why he still loves Jesus and the church.

Subscribe for free now, and you won’t miss Episode 57.

In the meantime, got a question?

Scroll down and leave a comment!